PM5D Subgroups

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PM5D Subgroups

Post  jacks on Sat Jun 05, 2010 1:53 pm

Has anyone used subgroups, not dca's, on the 5D ? For example, a drum subgroup (L&R), compressed and sent to stereo A as well as a drum dca group. Subgroups on faders is ideal. I think the only way to do it is send the drum channels, via aux, to a stereo mix, compress it and send the mix to stereo A, using the mix faders in the fader mode section. Does anyone have any other ideas ?

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Re: PM5D Subgroups

Post  JP on Sun Jun 06, 2010 5:34 pm

Create a stereo pair of mix outs, eg Mix 1 and Mix 2. In the user prefs set them up as 'fixed'. Send your drum channels to those channels. Choose those channels and compress.
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subgroups

Post  jacks on Sun Jun 06, 2010 5:55 pm

JP, thanks for your reply. Are those fixed groups automatically sent to stereo A ? and are those groups on faders in the fader mode section? if so, are they post compression and also sent to stereo A (or B)? thanks again.
J.

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Re: PM5D Subgroups

Post  davyneill on Mon Jun 07, 2010 2:27 pm

(Are those fixed groups automatically sent to stereo A ?) no, you have to send them "TO STEREO" remembering to deselect the appropriate input channels or you'll get phasing.

(and are those groups on faders in the fader mode section?) well... they can be because you can assign any channel whether input, output or dca to one of the 8 dca faders using Fader Assign.


(if so, are they post compression and also sent to stereo A (or B)?) compression is prefader on input channels and postfader on output channels. The Fader Assign section only gives you control of a fader (input or output) which exists on the console, it is not a channel fader in it's own right. Oh, and you can't send to A or B...only to both.

Regards

Davy

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more subgroups

Post  jacks on Mon Jun 07, 2010 4:38 pm

Thanks for the quick reply. It's all making sense now but what I'm trying to do is compress a stereo mix (subgroup) and send that mix/group to stereo A as well as the input channels assigned to that group so that the compressed group can be mixed in with the input channels to stereo A separately. Is this not possible? I have tried it and assigned the group to faders and weird things do start happening, ie phasing, making this technique pretty much unusable. It seems like it's either use the group to stereo or input channels to stereo, but not both. Any ideas?
Also, when using a paired mix as a subgroup to stereo with compression, don't the 'vari' and 'fixed' functions pretty much do the same thing after you've set the input channel to 0 nominal in vari mode. As long as they're both post fader and set to 0 I don't see a difference.
Thanks.

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Re: PM5D Subgroups

Post  davyneill on Tue Jun 08, 2010 5:40 am

(what I'm trying to do is compress a stereo mix (subgroup) and send that mix/group to stereo A as well as the input channels assigned to that group so that the compressed group can be mixed in with the input channels to stereo A separately)

What you could try is, sending the input channels to another pair of MIX buses and use that as your uncompressed feed "TO STEREO", again deselecting the input channels from "TO STEREO". The prob might be the extra digital "distance" when going via the MIX buses. Oh and i'd call what you're doing "Parallel Compression".

You're correct about FIXED and VARI being the same when they're at "0". It's useful to have FIXED when you're routing a lot of channels...getting 44 channels exactly to "0" would take far too long.

One more thing (and i apologise if i'm stating the obvious), don't forget that your output channels have panpots too which are relevant when sending TO STEREO.

Regards

Davy

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parallel compression

Post  jacks on Tue Jun 08, 2010 1:19 pm

interesting idea to use two groups, one compressed , one not, both sent to stereo A. Obviously the key is to deselect the input channels to stereo. This seems to be a design flaw that many other consoles can easily do without sounding 'phasey'.

Good point about the 'fixed' setting saving some time. useful too when sending the groups out of the console too, for recording etc.

Thanks.

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Re: PM5D Subgroups

Post  JP on Fri Jul 30, 2010 12:38 pm

Keep in mind that when you combine signals that are traveling 2 different paths in the digital world, you will have 2 different arrival times. The 5D does not compensate for the latency differences.

See the attached...




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